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-- why we hate. (https://www.jusunlee.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=15407)

Posted by hnefrdo on 02-18-2004 08:30 PM:

why we hate.

i just read a bunch of posts replying to H2O being happy about mr. atkin's death, and it reminded me of one of my past xanga posts:

Monday, January 12, 2004

i hate you!

i assume that my readers, by this time in life, has relized one cannot be loved by all people. take this time now to think of sumone yu don't like, or even hate. think about why yu feel the way yu do. "because he's so stupid!" is not a reason to dislike sumone. the two main causes of hatred is jealousy or betrayal.

yu don't dislike him because he lights his cigar with a 100 dollar bill for his lack of appreciation for money. yu dislike him because yu can't do the same thing.

now, if yu were the one that gave him the 100 dollar bill, and he lights his cigar with it. the element of dislike comes from a type of betrayal.

above is just an example of the possible source of hatred, but the same idea can be applied to almost any type of hatred towards one person, a group of people, an animal, etc.

i use the word, almost, in the paragraph above because there is a third, rare, source of hatred. like when peter parker's uncle gets killed by the robber. there is no element of jealousy or betrayal there. this is wut i call pure hatred. it exists, but it is not common.

just a thought.

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practice makes perfect.

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Posted by Crazydeb8ter on 02-18-2004 09:19 PM:

i think this would be more appropriate in the enlightenment forum.

moving.

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"The weight of this sad time we must obey,/ Speak what we feel, not what we ought to say./ The oldest hath borne most; we that are young/ Shall never see so much, nor live so long."
King Lear (V.3.300-304)

Posted by aaqthree on 02-18-2004 10:04 PM:

I disagree.

Hatred is often overused; I personally believe that I truly hate only two people, neither of whom have ever been close enough to me to betray me nor have any characteristics that appear enviable to me.

My hatred stems only from the way they conduct themselves and their lack of reasoning. Yes, this is basically the "I hate them because they're stupid" that you say is not a good reason to hate someone. I believe that it's a perfectly acceptable reason to hate people; much more acceptable than hating them out of envy or for any other reason like ethnic/racial or religious hatred. Envying others, to me, is pointless, and therefore should not be a good reason for hating someone.

Betrayal - yeah, I'll agree with that.

I think that everyone's different values and characteristics make it too hard to generalize when it comes to why people hate others. People will probably hate whatever characteristics are most in conflict with their own (though this is not always the case).

Posted by hnefrdo on 02-18-2004 11:40 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by aaqthree
I disagree.

Hatred is often overused; I personally believe that I truly hate only two people, neither of whom have ever been close enough to me to betray me nor have any characteristics that appear enviable to me.

My hatred stems only from the way they conduct themselves and their lack of reasoning. Yes, this is basically the "I hate them because they're stupid" that you say is not a good reason to hate someone. I believe that it's a perfectly acceptable reason to hate people; much more acceptable than hating them out of envy or for any other reason like ethnic/racial or religious hatred. Envying others, to me, is pointless, and therefore should not be a good reason for hating someone.

Betrayal - yeah, I'll agree with that.

I think that everyone's different values and characteristics make it too hard to generalize when it comes to why people hate others. People will probably hate whatever characteristics are most in conflict with their own (though this is not always the case).


your're confusing something else with hate. hate is an extreme and is often wrongly used to describe a simple annoyance. if yu still think otherwise, provide a counter-example for me.

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Posted by MasWusHot on 02-19-2004 02:28 AM:

i just think hate is a strong word that is thrown around too freely and people say it without realizing the meaning of hate..i dont think i hate anybody, theres people i dont like and who get on my nerves and stuff .. but i dont ever tell people i hate em, i used to when i was little, cuz i didnt udnerstand..shows whoever uses it now for stupid reasons like "i hate you because youre stupid" which i DO think is an inappropriate reason to hate someone, is pretty immature...

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Posted by Alchemist on 02-19-2004 02:57 AM:

quote:
Originally posted by hnefrdo
your're confusing something else with hate. hate is an extreme and is often wrongly used to describe a simple annoyance. if yu still think otherwise, provide a counter-example for me.



quote:
Originally posted by MasWusHot
i just think hate is a strong word that is thrown around too freely and people say it without realizing the meaning of hate..i dont think i hate anybody, theres people i dont like and who get on my nerves and stuff .. but i dont ever tell people i hate em, i used to when i was little, cuz i didnt udnerstand..shows whoever uses it now for stupid reasons like "i hate you because youre stupid" which i DO think is an inappropriate reason to hate someone, is pretty immature...


http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=hate

Also, hate can mean different things to different people. To you it may seem incorrectly used but to others it may seem correct.

Posted by MellowYellow on 02-19-2004 05:21 AM:

quote:
Originally posted by Alchemist
http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=hate

Also, hate can mean different things to different people. To you it may seem incorrectly used but to others it may seem correct.


Isn't everything though? Like LOVE. BUT that doesn't deny the fact that there is a SET OUT definition that "HAS" (mmm... okay fine) to be accepted by everyone.

Hum well you didn't REALLY disprove Henford yet, not in a way that makes sense to me yet:

Usage: Hate is the generic word, and implies that one is inflamed with extreme dislike. We abhor what is deeply repugnant to our sensibilities or feelings. We detest what contradicts so utterly our principles and moral sentiments that we feel bound to lift up our voice against it. What we abominate does equal violence to our moral and religious sentiments. What we loathe is offensive to our own nature, and excites unmingled disgust. Our Savior is said to have hated the deeds of the Nicolaitanes; his language shows that he loathed the lukewarmness of the Laodiceans; he detested the hypocrisy of the scribes and Pharisees; he abhorred the suggestions of the tempter in the wilderness.

Random: The opposite of good is bad ... not evil. [good & evil]

I don't really have an opinion, I just thought that pasting a link with an ambiguous argument... just plain sucked.

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Posted by aaqthree on 02-19-2004 09:57 PM:

Hate DOES mean different things to different people, and not everything is like that.

Most things are easily defineable, but when you go to the extremes like love and hate, you cannot say that there is one definition for it and one reason for it. Why do you love someone? Because they're nice to you, because they're good people? Those answers are too limiting because they don't explain why you'd love one nice, good person but not another. Similarly, being jealous of someone doesn't necesesarily mean that you'll hate them; it simply depends on the type of person you are.

I don't really get jealous too often, I really find it pointless. Therefore, that definition does not apply to me.

No one has betrayed me (to the point where I hold it against them to this day anyway), so that part, while it may apply to me in the future, does not apply to me right now. But I do agree that it is often the cause of hatred.

Some people believe that you have to have loved someone at one point in time in order to truly develop a hatred for them. I personally don't agree with that either, though I don't discredit it entirely. I could never hate anyone that I love, because I'd know why I loved the person in the first place.

I think hatred can be coupled or associated with any strong emotion, be it love, anger, or anything in between.

quote:
i just think hate is a strong word that is thrown around too freely and people say it without realizing the meaning of hate..i dont think i hate anybody, theres people i dont like and who get on my nerves and stuff .. but i dont ever tell people i hate em, i used to when i was little, cuz i didnt udnerstand..shows whoever uses it now for stupid reasons like "i hate you because youre stupid" which i DO think is an inappropriate reason to hate someone, is pretty immature...


To YOU it might not be an appropriate reason, but that doesn't make it wrong to everyone. Like I said, it depends on your values.

If you don't believe you hate anyone, fine. I can understand thinking that hatred in general is immature, but I don't think you can say that any specific reason for hatred is wrong (well, other than race, gender, etc), because that's telling someone what they should value.

Posted by Alchemist on 02-20-2004 02:28 AM:

quote:
Originally posted by MellowYellow
Isn't everything though? Like LOVE. BUT that doesn't deny the fact that there is a SET OUT definition that "HAS" (mmm... okay fine) to be accepted by everyone.

Hum well you didn't REALLY disprove Henford yet, not in a way that makes sense to me yet:


I don't really have an opinion, I just thought that pasting a link with an ambiguous argument... just plain sucked.


Henford had spoken of incorrect use.
He bid: provide a counter-example.
The link contains a counter-example.
If there is a set out definition that has to be accepted by everyone it does not rule out the possibility of alternate definitions.
What is this definite definition?
And this is permanent for which fellow?
Does it jest suck o dear MellowYellow?

Posted by hnefrdo on 02-20-2004 04:11 AM:

quote:
Originally posted by Alchemist
Henford had spoken of incorrect use.
He bid: provide a counter-example.
The link contains a counter-example.
If there is a set out definition that has to be accepted by everyone it does not rule out the possibility of alternate definitions.
What is this definite definition?
And this is permanent for which fellow?
Does it jest suck o dear MellowYellow?


wut the hell did yu just say?

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practice makes perfect.

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Posted by aaqthree on 02-20-2004 11:26 PM:

There's nothing odd about his post other than that one line thrown in there that's not in iambic pentameter.

Posted by Alchemist on 02-21-2004 02:25 AM:

quote:
Originally posted by aaqthree
There's nothing odd about his post other than that one line thrown in there that's not in iambic pentameter.


The people who do don't always speak so.

Posted by MellowYellow on 02-21-2004 06:05 AM:

Well you know what. Now I hate you Alchemist.

How's that? I hate you because I just do. PURE HATRED.

Henford said:

above is just an example of the possible source of hatred, but the same idea can be applied to almost any type of hatred towards one person, a group of people, an animal, etc.

The two main causes.. doesn't mean they're the only ones.

But Alchemist, you even agreed that Hatred is different to different people... so how are you, Alchemist, with utmost confidence definiing it? And what WAS your exact purpose of citing the dictionary if you point was that "hate" means something different to anyone? I just didn't see how you citing the dictionary helped to further your first comment/argument. I think your motive was not actually arguing on the topic.. i think you were just trying to disprove henford for the sake of it. Therefore... according to ME... it sucked. . Your comment meant "different things to different people."

HATE.

- I think you were referring to my creative writing topic with the iambic pentameter bit. I resent you for poking fun at that. Even though it was for a school assignment, there was truth in it.

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Posted by hnefrdo on 02-21-2004 06:35 AM:

quote:
Originally posted by MellowYellow
[And what WAS your exact purpose of citing the dictionary if you point was that "hate" means something different to anyone? [/B]


that makes hella sense. lol. i win!

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Posted by MellowYellow on 02-21-2004 07:13 AM:

And what WAS your exact purpose of citing the dictionary if your point was that "hate" means something different to everyone?

Sorry I have to fix the grammer and words... It is bugging me.

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Posted by H2oBaebe on 02-21-2004 08:04 AM:

hatred is 'over rated' so shut the f*ck up! hehe.. u know i'm kidding! ''wut is lub baby don't hurt me! dont' hurt me, no mo'!''

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Posted by Alchemist on 02-21-2004 06:22 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by MellowYellow
And what WAS your exact purpose of citing the dictionary if you point was that "hate" means something different to anyone? I just didn't see how you citing the dictionary helped to further your first comment/argument.


http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=hate

What should we do? Read meaning number 2?

quote:
Originally posted by MellowYellow

Henford said:

above is just an example of the possible source of hatred, but the same idea can be applied to almost any type of hatred towards one person, a group of people, an animal, etc.


Henford had talked of other things than that.
Henford had talked of uses that are wrong.

Posted by aaqthree on 02-21-2004 06:36 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by MellowYellow
Well you know what. Now I hate you Alchemist.

How's that? I hate you because I just do. PURE HATRED.


Real mature.

quote:
Henford said:

above is just an example of the possible source of hatred, but the same idea can be applied to almost any type of hatred towards one person, a group of people, an animal, etc.

The two main causes.. doesn't mean they're the only ones.


My contention is that they shouldn't be considered "main" causes even. Say "possible" causes, or "potential" causes. When you overgeneralize about the causes of the extremes like love and hate, then you are basically saying that all people have the same values (but if you pay any attention to the world around you it's obvious that everyone is different).

quote:
But Alchemist, you even agreed that Hatred is different to different people... so how are you, Alchemist, with utmost confidence definiing it? And what WAS your exact purpose of citing the dictionary if you point was that "hate" means something different to anyone? I just didn't see how you citing the dictionary helped to further your first comment/argument. I think your motive was not actually arguing on the topic.. i think you were just trying to disprove henford for the sake of it. Therefore... according to ME... it sucked. . Your comment meant "different things to different people."


Let's see...Henford said to "provide a counter example". The link merely did just that. He was not saying that it was the sole definition of hatred; Henford was saying that the definition I was using was wrong, and asked to provide a counter-example (Alchemist simply pointed out that some definitions of hatred do agree with mine).

quote:
- I think you were referring to my creative writing topic with the iambic pentameter bit. I resent you for poking fun at that. Even though it was for a school assignment, there was truth in it.


Or, you know, he could have just been making a reference to Shakespeare (like "jest" instead of "just"...Shakespeare was known for, among other things, his puns/double entendres).

quote:
that makes hella sense. lol. i win!


quote:
What should we do? Read meaning number 2?


Blue team...FLAG RETURNED!

Posted by Alchemist on 02-21-2004 06:39 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by aaqthree



Or, you know, he could have just been making a reference to Shakespeare (like "jest" instead of "just"...Shakespeare was known for, among other things, his puns/double entendres).


Ay it stands so.

quote:
Originally posted by aaqthree


Blue team...FLAG RETURNED!


Who said that?

Posted by hnefrdo on 02-21-2004 08:14 PM:

im just gonna restate. your're confusing something else with hate. hate is an extreme and is often wrongly used to describe a simple annoyance. if yu still think otherwise, provide a counter-example for me.

i used the man lighting a cigar with money for my examples of the types of hate. name people yu hate that is not for a reason i have stated. tell us why yu hate them. that would be a counter-example.

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