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-- If this won't get my point accross....then...I'll just think of something else... (https://www.jusunlee.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=14395)

Posted by StardustWolfCry on 11-12-2003 12:52 AM:

If this won't get my point accross....then...I'll just think of something else...

Okay, religions say there's a Heaven, and a Hell. I see there are NEW logics after life, and Heaven and Hell ARE new logics. New logics mean ANYTHING, which I'm sure most people know the definition of. ANYTHING includes relogions. Yet, people say I'm wrong, which means EVERYTHING is wrong, which means THEIR OWN beliefs are wrong. And even if my belief of logic beyond logic IS wrong, then that would mean ANYTHING is wrong, making a whole new logic in its own...but people still say I'm wrong, which is only further proving themselves wrong...and, everything God does is supposed to be for the better...yet, everything has flaws...if he has his reasons, that only means a new logic can explain it. But if we die, and go to Hell because we didn't believe in him, how can he do that? (Why he's even ABOVE us I don't know) He can't do that, because, we had no PROOF he existed, and yet, he created us so that we WON'T believe in him...like a man, who has a promise to another, but loses his memory. Then he's punished for it, and he doesn't know why...SAME THING. So basically, if I am wrong YOU are too, because EVERYTHING INCLUDES YOU.

Tell me if you agree...if you disagree, tell why, and chances are, you're saying that ANYTHING POSSIBLE is wrong, saying YOU are wrong....

__________________
Ironically, we live to die... life is inevitable, so we are either living, or we are dead, but where are we when we are dead? Maybe we aren't ever "dead".Life is a memory. Time is always moving, so there is no now, thus all life is, is just a memory.

By.....me...Although I'm sure some one thought of that before me...

Posted by TorrentialVVind on 11-13-2003 02:03 PM:

Are you.. Anti-Religion? Atheist?

I agree with what you are saying, and I understood everything, too. I'm actually Anti-Religion. I think that Religion is just another way to cover up peoples' insecurities.

I believe that there is no God, and if there were One, There wouldn't really be so many problems. That's just IMO. But if there truly were a God, I think that the world would work differently.


Back to what you were trying to say.
If somebody commits a murder, and he gets the death penalty, the person giving the death penalty would be just as bad as the murderer himself.

If the murderer is 'wrong'
than the person giving the death penalty is 'wrong' too.

__________________
Xanga: LittleMoogle
AIM: r0ck leee

I want to make a Naruto banner. ._.; That's in construction.

Posted by StardustWolfCry on 11-15-2003 01:45 PM:

Religion is possible, since religion is a new logic in itself....but, unfortunately, humans are too stupid to find what we call "truth"....and death may be the only way to escape this crappy "reality"...

__________________
Ironically, we live to die... life is inevitable, so we are either living, or we are dead, but where are we when we are dead? Maybe we aren't ever "dead".Life is a memory. Time is always moving, so there is no now, thus all life is, is just a memory.

By.....me...Although I'm sure some one thought of that before me...

Posted by Alchemist on 11-15-2003 07:50 PM:

Re: If this won't get my point accross....then...I'll just think of something else...

quote:
Originally posted by StardustWolfCry
Okay, religions say there's a Heaven, and a Hell. I see there are NEW logics after life, and Heaven and Hell ARE new logics. New logics mean ANYTHING, which I'm sure most people know the definition of. ANYTHING includes relogions. Yet, people say I'm wrong, which means EVERYTHING is wrong, which means THEIR OWN beliefs are wrong.


If I say you are wrong suggesting that anything is wrong, not everything, then the suggestion is that only certain possibilities, if any, are correct.


an·y·thing
pron.
Any object, occurrence, or matter whatever.

eve·ry·thing
pron.
1. All things or all of a group of things.
2. All relevant matters

Posted by Alchemist on 11-15-2003 08:14 PM:

Re: Are you.. Anti-Religion? Atheist?

quote:
Originally posted by TorrentialVVind
I believe that there is no God, and if there were One, There wouldn't really be so many problems. That's just IMO. But if there truly were a God, I think that the world would work differently.


Why would the world be different if God exists? Why does he not exist because of the way things are now? If things are bad it doesn't prove the non-exsistence of God.

A friend of mine said he believes that the afterlife is spritual, not physical.

Another friend of mine cited a book which said that in modern day God does not take part in occurences. So basically God created everything but is just watching us right now.

Posted by StardustWolfCry on 11-16-2003 03:22 PM:

Our world CAN exist if there is no God, for the one reason that there are new logics...there can be a way, that we can "exist" without having there be a god....we can't know of what we don't know of...

Why did God create us just to watch billions suffer? Is this some kind of cruel joke? How could an all loving God Do this to us?

__________________
Ironically, we live to die... life is inevitable, so we are either living, or we are dead, but where are we when we are dead? Maybe we aren't ever "dead".Life is a memory. Time is always moving, so there is no now, thus all life is, is just a memory.

By.....me...Although I'm sure some one thought of that before me...

Posted by TorrentialVVind on 11-17-2003 02:03 PM:

IMO...

"God" is just another way to cover insecurities.

Who created the people?
God did.

Who created the trees, etc.
God did.


I'm not trying to go against any religion. Nor am I saying that the world cannot exist without God, vice versa.

But if he did exist and 'loved us' he wouldn't backstab us, nor make us feel like it.

__________________
Xanga: LittleMoogle
AIM: r0ck leee

I want to make a Naruto banner. ._.; That's in construction.

Posted by PsychoSnowman on 11-17-2003 05:30 PM:

God is not just a way to cover up insecurities. It is an explanation of how everything is here. I do not see why everyone is so sure of themselves.

__________________
Long messages do not equal aggravation of any sort,
rather they reflect nothing more than a response of insight
that should always be read in a matter-of-fact tone.

"Those womyn that seek equality with men, lack determination."

"I beseech you, in the bowels of Christ, think it possible you may be wrong."
-Cromwell

Posted by micron on 11-17-2003 07:59 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by StardustWolfCry
Our world CAN exist if there is no God, for the one reason that there are new logics...there can be a way, that we can "exist" without having there be a god....we can't know of what we don't know of...
ofcourse it can. theres infinite possibilities of the unknown.


quote:
Originally posted by StardustWolfCry
Why did God create us just to watch billions suffer? Is this some kind of cruel joke? How could an all loving God Do this to us?
no no. youre mistaking God to be some personal and active God, the Christian God. many believe God to be a distant Creator. and thats it.


quote:
Originally posted by TorrentialVVind
Who created the people?
God did.

Who created the trees, etc.
God did.
how about, what are tress made of? atoms. what are atoms made of? protons, neutrons, electrons. and they? quarks. and they? strings. and strings? and how about after that? we'll never be statisfied with what we know, and so, it is infinity we strive for in our quest to understand the world around us. the truth will be ever so close, yet ever so far, no matter the advances we make in science.

it is for this reason I beleive in God, a purely intellectual standpoint, that nature of inifinity instilled in us. it all has to come from somewhere, for every action theres an equal reaction, but what started it?


quote:
Originally posted by TorrentialVVind
But if he did exist and 'loved us' he wouldn't backstab us, nor make us feel like it.
who said God loved us in the first place? must He have emotions? and even if He did, what is love really, in God's mind? what makes you think youre capable of understanding His mind as to judge Him?

will a computer ever understand the mind of its creator?

Posted by TorrentialVVind on 11-18-2003 01:32 PM:

quote:
who said God loved us in the first place? must He have emotions? and even if He did, what is love really, in God's mind? what makes you think youre capable of understanding His mind as to judge Him?




But why believe in somebody that is there to.. maybe destroy?

Wouldn't you rather believe in something, somebody who creates and destroys for the good?

Or..would that be too good to be true?

__________________
Xanga: LittleMoogle
AIM: r0ck leee

I want to make a Naruto banner. ._.; That's in construction.

Posted by StardustWolfCry on 11-18-2003 08:35 PM:

It doesn't matter what we are here for...it won't matter. NOTHING does....Some people believe love is why we're here...below and behold, you can love people all you want, but it won't really accomplish much...it will only make you "happy" which is human standards, and human standards are crapped up, because humans themselves are. My point is, whatever we do, it won't have purpose or reason. We die, we go to heaven, so what? What does it accomplish? However, new logic may be able to answer that question...

__________________
Ironically, we live to die... life is inevitable, so we are either living, or we are dead, but where are we when we are dead? Maybe we aren't ever "dead".Life is a memory. Time is always moving, so there is no now, thus all life is, is just a memory.

By.....me...Although I'm sure some one thought of that before me...

Posted by PsychoSnowman on 11-18-2003 08:46 PM:

quote:
Originally posted by StardustWolfCry
It doesn't matter what we are here for...it won't matter. NOTHING does....Some people believe love is why we're here...below and behold, you can love people all you want, but it won't really accomplish much...it will only make you "happy" which is human standards, and human standards are crapped up, because humans themselves are.


No matter how loudly you exclaim your opinion on others, they are not going to suddenly become enlightened to your point of view. You cannot say nothing matters, and expect people to have no way to disagree with you because people do.

You also cannot say it objectively does not accomplish much. It may not only make you "happy", it could accomplish other things that you cannot see because you are "crapped up" (as you say all humans are).

Accept some other perspectives, it will save you some time. This debate is bootless. You are so certain it is laughable.

__________________
Long messages do not equal aggravation of any sort,
rather they reflect nothing more than a response of insight
that should always be read in a matter-of-fact tone.

"Those womyn that seek equality with men, lack determination."

"I beseech you, in the bowels of Christ, think it possible you may be wrong."
-Cromwell

Posted by StardustWolfCry on 11-18-2003 09:26 PM:

Explain then, how there CAN be purpose.

__________________
Ironically, we live to die... life is inevitable, so we are either living, or we are dead, but where are we when we are dead? Maybe we aren't ever "dead".Life is a memory. Time is always moving, so there is no now, thus all life is, is just a memory.

By.....me...Although I'm sure some one thought of that before me...

Posted by PsychoSnowman on 11-18-2003 09:56 PM:

how there can be a purpose? if something created us, there very well could be a purpose.

Here is the question that is harder to answer, why can there not be a purpose?

__________________
Long messages do not equal aggravation of any sort,
rather they reflect nothing more than a response of insight
that should always be read in a matter-of-fact tone.

"Those womyn that seek equality with men, lack determination."

"I beseech you, in the bowels of Christ, think it possible you may be wrong."
-Cromwell

Posted by MasWusHot on 11-18-2003 10:26 PM:

whys it matter, just wait till you die

__________________
<img src="http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v48/xxkpopxx/bhgft.bmp"><br><br>
its better to lose a lover, than to love a loser

Posted by TorrentialVVind on 11-19-2003 01:45 PM:

I don't think we're here for the sake of love.

If we were.. Why is there death?

__________________
Xanga: LittleMoogle
AIM: r0ck leee

I want to make a Naruto banner. ._.; That's in construction.

Posted by MasWusHot on 11-19-2003 08:13 PM:

cuz thats how it is..not an answer for everything, jeez oh man, lol .. some things you just wont kno

__________________
<img src="http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v48/xxkpopxx/bhgft.bmp"><br><br>
its better to lose a lover, than to love a loser

Posted by TorrentialVVind on 11-19-2003 09:24 PM:

But why..?

Why is our world like this?

With murder and everything..?

__________________
Xanga: LittleMoogle
AIM: r0ck leee

I want to make a Naruto banner. ._.; That's in construction.

Posted by Alchemist on 11-20-2003 03:56 AM:

quote:
Originally posted by TorrentialVVind
I don't think we're here for the sake of love.

If we were.. Why is there death?


Oops sounds like someone believes that there exsists something that maybe destroys.

quote:
Originally posted by TorrentialVVind
But why believe in somebody that is there to.. maybe destroy?

Posted by StardustWolfCry on 11-20-2003 10:19 PM:

Isn't this why our logic sucks? This world was horribly created to leave our question unanswered. Also, humans themselves were also crappily made, always wanting more...we will never be satisfied with what we get as an answer... So why did a creator, if there was one, create us like this? We suffer because of HIS (or her, or something else...) misdeed and failure of creating us... But, in a different logic, there may be reason.... I feel I'm being a bit repetative in saying that...

__________________
Ironically, we live to die... life is inevitable, so we are either living, or we are dead, but where are we when we are dead? Maybe we aren't ever "dead".Life is a memory. Time is always moving, so there is no now, thus all life is, is just a memory.

By.....me...Although I'm sure some one thought of that before me...
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